Oil Leak

[Spyderlock]

Hey, just wondering if anyone has had trouble with the front crank oil seal leaking? I changed it once about a month ago along with the oil pump seal. It started leaking again, dripping from under the crank pulley behind the timing belt cover, so I took everything back off and found the oil pump seal leaking again. Changed it for the second time and a week later I have another leak coming from behind the crank pulley/timing cover. It's leaking about a quart per week and making the valves tick when it gets that low. I'm guessing the crank seal again. I'm taking it apart again on Saturday to be sure. I bought the seals from the local auto parts store, dealer price was a little high. Is this a common issue with these motors? I have a '96 2WD with the 2.4 motor. Thanks!

[camoit]

Then the pulley has a grove in it. You need to check it or replace it for a new one. The metal will wear away and allow the oil to get past. Or you have high crank case pressure from blow by.

[Spyderlock]

Didn't think about crank case pressure, what would be a cause of that? Thanks for the help. I've done all the maintenance on my truck, timing belt etc., but am still learning.

[pennyman1]

Stuck closed PCV valve will cause it - clean it or replace it.

[Spyderlock]

Changed the PCV valve this morning, will have to wait til tomorrow to check the entire system. I hear guys talking about blow-by when you take the oil cap off. How much blow-by would be normal. I feel air coming out, not enough to blow oil everywhere, no steam. Thanks for the help.

[recian]

Oil would blow by the rings, stem seals, rotating seals and eventually, gaskets if there's too much pressure. The oil cap seals the system. That's why you feel something coming out because the natural movement of pistons pressurizes the crank case (which is why you have a PCV) That's how most cars work anyway. Some nissans you have to pull the dipstick out while filling them to vent the crank case since filling closes off the oil cap filler. Likewise those cars you better not pull the stick out while running or boom lol

[Spyderlock]

I think what's coming out the oil fill is normal pressure. Gonna remove timing belt and all the gears tomorrow and see what I find. I will let you know what I find. Thanks so much...

[recian]

When u put it in did you put butloads of grease on it and make absolutely sure the seal was seated on the crank snout before pushing it down? If you roll on the rear half of that seal and make sure it's straight then you can slide it on. If you're not careful the lip of the seal will fold and leak. Theyre very sensitive. I put aftermarket ones on my 94 when I did my rebuilt and no leaks yet so I don't think it's the quality of seal. Usually if PCV makes them leak it'll make more than just one leak, especially when u replaced one and the rest have high miles on them it'll make them leak next.

[Fordubishi]

the other thing to check is the crank pulley and see if there is a worn spot on it where the seal runs. if there is a grove or its worn down then it will leak and either needs to be replaced or repaired with a speedy sleeve.

[Spyderlock]

You guys are on to something. My brother was a mechanic for Ford for 10 years until coming to the Fire Dept. with me. I asked him this morning what he thought and he said the exact same thing about using alot of grease, and making sure the crank doesn't have a groove worn in it. I don't remember a groove when I changed it but will be sure to inspect it good tomorrow. He also said he packs grease in the back to keep the spring form popping out when he's seating it. All good ideas, I appreciate them all.

[camoit]

Any of us would help you do job, but none of us are close to you.

[4cylinders]

hey, did you put any sealer between the balancer and the crank?

[Spyderlock]

Ok..... so here's where I'm at. Woke up at 8:30 this morning and got started. Had the timing belt off by 9am. The crank seal is fine, absolutely no oil. The problem is at the oil pump seal again. I've changed it twice, this will be the third time.. Felt the shaft for any worn grooves but found none, it's completely smooth. Looking in the area where the seal fits I do see a small machined hole there that leaks a tiny bit of oil, not sure if this is normal or if there's a seal on the back side I need to change now. The guy at the auto parts store said the problem could be... the seal I am ordering from them is part of a kit originally made up of the seal and a repair sleeve, therefore the seal has an ever so slight larger inside diameter. When used with the original shaft and no sleeve it would make sense that it would leak because the ID would be to big. I really can't confirm his theory though. Anyway, I ordered a new seal and repair sleeve just incase the shaft is worn and I can't feel it. Parts will be in Monday. I am using a thin layer of sealer on the outside of the seal. I did take the cam out today and noticed the lifters were really worn where they meet the valve stems so I bought 8 new ones. Installed them, put the cam back according to specs, and replaced the cam seal while I had it out. Love my truck and can't wait to get it running again. The guys at the fire dept. call it the wheel barrow but I would take it over any of their Fords or Chevys any day of the week. Does anyone have input concerning the inside diameter theory I mentioned. Thanks again guys

[camoit]

That makes sense If it has never had the repair sleeve installed it will dump oil. Ether get the stock seal or the repair sleeve and carefully install it. Some times they come with the tool to install it. There easy to destroy when installing.

[Spyderlock]

I had never heard of a repair sleeve until my brother mentioned it yesterday. Any tips would be appreciated. Does it just slide over the shaft, do I need to lubricate it before I install, should it just press on or will it need to be carefully tapped on? Thanks.

[camoit]

They are taped into place over the shaft. I would first try to find the correct seal. But if you have already ordered the repair sleeve no big deal. There just tapped into place.


4813

[Spyderlock]

Am I correct in assuming the sleeve is tapped back as far as it will go? What do you think is the easiest, and most gentle, way to tap the seal on? Looks too thin to risk tapping it on with a socket. Would you lube the inside before sliding it on or will that compromise the function later on.? Maybe lube it with some WD40. Thanks

[recian]

That makes sense. I had a hard time getting a gasket for my pump. Only way to get the right one is to buy a new pump. And i didnt need one. I was so afraid my pump would leak after rebuild but so far so good. The lifter wear is common for these engines. It makes a huge difference. The gasket i got wasnt perfect. The oil filter housing seal wasnt right and i used liquid gasket. Make sure to stick the lifters in oil and prime them before install. Also being soaked in oil makes em stick to the rockers and they wont fall out.

[Spyderlock]

I've already installed the lifters, didn't soak them but the box they came in said they were primed. If not they should build a prime after a few minutes of driving shouldn't they?

[recian]

I bought the same ones and they came to me dry in a bag. I put em in oil and actuated them and some air bubbles came out. They should prime up while the engine is idling but don't rev it when you crank it. Remember those open your valves so it may run a little rough til they pump up. I recommend you pull the fuel injector harness. It connects at the firewall, follow the injectors up to 2 plugs. One is for dist other is for injectors. dont try to mess with individual connectors since theyre hard to get to and will break when touched. Then crank it over about 30 secs (or til the oil light goes out) and that should prime the oil system. That's what Mitsubishi engineers and training center instructors tell you to do when you install or rebuild an engine, crank it without fuel for 30 secs or so to prime it.

[camoit]

Am I correct in assuming the sleeve is tapped back as far as it will go? What do you think is the easiest, and most gentle, way to tap the seal on? Looks too thin to risk tapping it on with a socket. Would you lube the inside before sliding it on or will that compromise the function later on.? Maybe lube it with some WD40. Thanks

Depending on how large it is just hit it with a mallet or if you have a tight fitting peace of pipe. You can even warm it in an oven to 350 and quickly. I'm talking quick. slip it on the shaft. Out of the oven and on the shaft with in 2-3 seconds.

[Spyderlock]

Thanks RECIAN. Could I just pull the fuel pump fuse and then take off the coil wire to eliminate fuel and spark, then turn the motor over a few times to prime it?

[pennyman1]

If you put the balancer in the freezer and heat up the sleeve it should drop right on, just don't use your fingers to pick up the sleeve when hot.

[Spyderlock]

Balancer is still in the moter, and I'm working outside so it would be a t least a minute before I could get the sleeve outside to the truck. Probably gonna lube it up and tap it on gently. The sleeve came with an installation tool. Thanks guys...

[camoit]

It came with the tool. Should pop on with no problems.

[Spyderlock]

Update... The oil leak has been operator error the whole time. The first time the oil pump seal leaked it was legit, probably just worn. When I removed it and put the new one on I pressed it in flush with the moter just like the crank seal is. Didin't realize until I put the new one on yesterday that it sets about a qurter of an inch past being flush. When I was leaving it flush the inside of the seal was probably not even touching the shaft that it's suppose to sit around. Put it on yesterday, didn't use the repair sleeve once I figured out what I was doing wrong, used a socket and hammer to tap ( POUND ) it in. It was an extremely tight fit. I know the seal is now at least touching the shaft it fits over, and I'm pretty sure it's actually seated around it but couldn't confirm with my light and mirror. I will check it in a few days to see if the leak is cured. The new lifters made the motor so quiet that I didn't realize it was running. Thanks for everyones help!

[camoit]

If the new seal is made for the repair sleeve then you will need to use it. Other wise it will fail due to the difference of the lip being a larger diameter hole. It would be a difference of about 0.010" that is a lot in engine tolerances.

[Spyderlock]

I actually damaged the seal that came with the sleeve so I had to buy another to put on. Thanks for bringing that point up though. The new seal fit tight on the outside and inside diameter. Changed it Monday morning, checked today and no oil leak! Thanks for all the help guys...!