DESPERATE for help(charging system)

[stockD50]

I have now gone through 6 reman alternators from lordco(bosch and ac delco). It will be good for a while then stop charging , then i saw someone said they have a low output of amps. Tried putting a nippondenso alternator out of a 5.9 magnum,not working. Can anyone tell me how many amps an alternator puts out on a 1990 2.4l d50. And any suggestions,any info, any ideas of different alternators that will work,if its worth it to get the alternator rebuilt. Anything will be much appreciated, thanks

[ragragtimetime]

holy _____! something does not sound right. I'm not a 2nd gen guy but I know a 1st gen WILL run without an alternator (needs a good battery) I'd try to see if it runs without the alternator belt (maybe its insufficient grounds?) need a 2nd gen guy to chime in...6 alternators!

[stockD50]

so try and see if it will run at all? or for a bit until it dies?

[camoit]

They are 35 amp on a first gen, 45 on a second I think. Some guys have put ones on from a van and that gets you about 65. There limited in a stock configuration. You need to build a mount and put on an AC Delco 110 amp unit. I'm sure some other guys will chime in soon.

[stockD50]

now if i go to a store what do i want to say for the 110 amp ac delco unit, and still need a mount for it?

[BradMph]

They are 35 amp on a first gen, 45 on a second I think. Some guys have put ones on from a van and that gets you about 65. There limited in a stock configuration. You need to build a mount and put on an AC Delco 110 amp unit. I'm sure some other guys will chime in soon.

35 amp? Mine came with a 45 amp stock on 1st gen.





now if i go to a store what do i want to say for the 110 amp ac delco unit, and still need a mount for it?

When you get your answer, depending on which alternator you decide on, maybe try rockauto or possibly somewhere that the price doesn't empty your wallet. When you get your new one, you want to bring yours in to match up casing.
1st gens were able to switch out to a 100amp off the 1990 Mitsubishi Van and 87-89 Starion, both 100amp. Depending on if your switching from another vehicle's alt and going to upgrade yours for higher amps will decide on your amp plug, pulley, and mounting ears.
Just for example which I am not sure this is what your searching for.
The 1st gen upgrade to 100amp has some changes to do before it fits. One being the plug in the back. Though I think yours has the right plug fitting for a straight swap. The next thing to watch for is the mounting ears. These should be in the same position so you don't end up having to buy a shorter or longer belt if the upgrade is different. Last thing would be the pulleys. Serpentine or V belt design and they also come with internal pulley fans and the external pulley fans blades. Other then these things, the swap isn't hard at all.
Here is an image of the 1st gen alt and the upgrade to 100amp.

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I also have a question about all these alternators you go through. Didn't these that died have a warranty on them at all? Going through them like you have, I would purchase the extra warranty just in case. I also would try to correct the problem you must have with electrical so as to not kill any more. These things are not cheap and I'm sure it must be a headache to have to keep replacing.
Anyway, I am not sure if this will help or if this is what your trying to get an answer for. Mitsubishi alts are not that different from each other and your truck is in the year that it should be an easy upgrade to higher amp if your doing that.

[stockD50]

I did get them from lordco so i got them replaced for no cost, just the orignal cost for the first one.
I did forget to mention i have a stereo system with a sub and all that and a tach, so i believe the alternator just cant hold the load, so thats why i want a higher output. If a alternator cant hold a load will that burn out the alternator?
Thank you for the info but i do have a 2nd gen, i tried the nippondenso alternator off a 5.9 magnum that someone else posted but he had a first gen.
i saw that someone said he had a 92 4g64 and put a 98 amp alt. off of a 2000ish montero sport, so ive been looking for a part number for tht cause those are rare enough let alone in the junk yard, so if you got any info on those or charts or someone that does, id appreciate it very much, thanks

[pennyman1]

you can definitely fry alternators with excessive current draw. Someone posted on here about alternators from later caravans would work. I have a small case GM alternator on Geronimo - housing was for an 4 cylinder buick 2.0 or similar. It is not a bolt on - it requires brackets made to align the pulley to the crank pulley

[ragragtimetime]

I did get them from lordco so i got them replaced for no cost, just the orignal cost for the first one.
I did forget to mention i have a stereo system with a sub and all that and a tach, so i believe the alternator just cant hold the load, so thats why i want a higher output. If a alternator cant hold a load will that burn out the alternator?
Thank you for the info but i do have a 2nd gen, i tried the nippondenso alternator off a 5.9 magnum that someone else posted but he had a first gen.
i saw that someone said he had a 92 4g64 and put a 98 amp alt. off of a 2000ish montero sport, so ive been looking for a part number for tht cause those are rare enough let alone in the junk yard, so if you got any info on those or charts or someone that does, id appreciate it very much, thanks
aaah yes the killer stereo (in more ways than 1). alternator output can not keep up with the demand of hitting the metallica bass notes. (my headlights would intermittently dim depending on the song). I kept the original alternator but installed another deep cycle marine battery:
http://www.mightyram50.net/vbulletin/attachment.php?attachmentid=9104&thumb=1&d=1397180231

[stockD50]

Thank you for confirming that, but there is a draw when i touch the ground on the negative, so tomorrow im gonna go through the fuses and test it, does the stereo sub n amp naturally create a large draw?
theres been a few times i had to pull over and turn off my headlights etc and let it idle to charge a few times, somewhat adapted to the high maintenance D50, but its still winning against me.

[geezer101]

If you're using a powered amp, it'll pull a decent amount of current. The stock alternator isn't up to much more demand than what the factory accessories require to run. A friend of mine ran 2 big amps and his alternator would get so badly loaded up it dropped engine rpm (and it got pretty hot too)
btw it is bad a powered amp to run on low current. It can damage it plus it will affect audio quality. A higher output alternator and bigger CCA rated battery are worthwhile upgrades.

[geezer101]

*bad to run a powered amp on low current... :doh:

[stockD50]

thanks appreciated, im still looking for the montero alternator part number, if anyone knows it or knows someone that knows it itd be appreciated, and how do i go about a higher cca battery, anywhere that sells batteries will have these or whats the deal?

[stockD50]

what cca do you recommend , if you know by any chance?

[geezer101]

Go big - like 500+ CCA's. It will keep a heap of power on reserve when you need it and the starter motor will throw the engine over with extra muscle. I went a bit silly with a Galant wagon (think 70's Dodge Colt) I built from bits of everything and used a 13 plate light commercial truck battery. It could jump start the universe lol

[stockD50]

hahahha fuck, thanks for the info

[stockD50]

So what will I be looking for to eliminate the draw? Exposed wire , too thin wire , what else is there that can possibly create a draw?
And if it is my stereo system is there anything I can install to eliminate it ?

[ragragtimetime]

Thank you for confirming that, but there is a draw when i touch the ground on the negative, so tomorrow im gonna go through the fuses and test it, does the stereo sub n amp naturally create a large draw?
theres been a few times i had to pull over and turn off my headlights etc and let it idle to charge a few times, somewhat adapted to the high maintenance D50, but its still winning against me.


is the powered amp on all the time?....it should only "power up" when the radio sends a signal & it may be receiving that signal depending on how the radio is wired or how the radio works. verify that there is only 1 "main" live power being sent to amp when key is removed. also curious about the "headlight etc" statement....what are the other aftermarket items (if any) installed. ps-we love pics!:gotpics:

[stockD50]

It is not powered when the key is off, and I have led headlights , aftermarket tachometer , aftermarket deck amp and sub.when I get home from work today I'll check the one live wire to the amp. It's live when on,correct?

[stockD50]

I'll post pics tonight

[ragragtimetime]

It is not powered when the key is off, and I have led headlights , aftermarket tachometer , aftermarket deck amp and sub.when I get home from work today I'll check the one live wire to the amp. It's live when on,correct?

amp "feed" would be live when off (off meaning key out, no radio sending signal, amp is not on although it does have power available at the amp connection site), but only the main feed (1 wire, usually run directly from battery, with ~ a 30amp inline fuse). if you find more than 1 live wire at the amp when "off" this is where the issue lies (but I have a suggestion if you do find more than 1 live wire).

[stockD50]

So check all the amp connections for power?

[ragragtimetime]

yes & hopefully only find 12v emitting from 1 connection in "off" mode :thumbup:

[stockD50]

Thanks man I'll check it after work

[stockD50]

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so on my amp theres two connections that have .03 volts and one 12 volts. forgot to mention i got 2 6 inch speakers hooked up. is there anything on the back of my deck i should check out? certain voltages on certain wires?
my cousin did some wiring to a switch so i can turn off my headlights and its 16 gauge , way too thin compared to the other wire already in there, which my dad says that could create a draw.
i have learned to not trust another 18 year old when they say theyre basically an electrician.

[geezer101]

Only wires with voltage out from the head unit will be a blue remote trigger wire for the amp (which you've already figured out) and depending on the unit another signal wire for a power antenna. And they both should only have low voltage output when the head unit is in power on mode. Yup, you got a monster battery. That'll have enough juice to keep anything going as long as the alternator is up to it as well.

[ragragtimetime]

"two connections that have .03 volts and one 12 volts"...were detected in the "off" mode? if yes then the .03 volt is your issue (i'm guessing its probably the signal to turn the amp on so the amp is on all the time)...a simple fix would be an inline manual switch on the .03 volt feed or (a far more time consuming approach) trace the source & have it re-wired to be live only when in "on" (key turn activated) or if discovered the source is the radio then the radio would have to be re-wired to be live only when in "on" (key turn activated).

as for the headlight "off ability" issue, due to the thin wiring (or high gauge #) there is no draw but you are certainly running a risk of electrical fire...to further comment on this issue I would need to see a schematic drawn of how it was done.

hope this helps. peace

[geezer101]

.03 V is a really negligible voltage drain but what is really strange that you're getting any voltage output with the head unit off. If the head unit is hooked up to a live circuit it should always have total system power present going into it but nothing out until it's on (the memory wire is always live 100% of the time so that will have a continuous current draw but not even close to causing any trouble).
Why is the headlight circuit running a bypass? Your switch assembly got a fault? :scratchheadyellow:

[ragragtimetime]

I agree with geezer101 that .03 volts is negligible voltage drain, however, I strongly believe this .03 volt wire is turning the amp "on" thus allowing the amp to "pull" from the 12 volt source reading...which leads me to another question...is the amp warm (even the slightest minute amount) after the truck has been sitting in the "off" position? if yes then the amp is "pulling" from the 12 volt source.

[stockD50]

yes that helps!
the amp only gets warm after playing loud music for a while, never when its off.
and for the switch i wanted to be able to turn off my headlights because of my charging issues, so i could take some load off of the alternator.

[stockD50]

i went to lordco and asked about the montero alternator, they said they can get one and is 75 amps. now will that be enough to run my truck on a 4g64. or you guys got part numbers and years make model higher output alternators that you guys are running? (4g64 compatible)

[Yoshiwarrior]

I would be careful with the stereo on a stock alternator. Mine couldn't handle it. Eventually my alternator gave up. It won't charge at all. I have to boost it just drive it. And now I have to figure out what to replace it with.

[geezer101]

I'm looking into using an alternator off a Hyundai engine. I can get them all day and they're all at least 90 amp output. Just have to find out if they're compatible with the pulley alignment and mount.

[Yoshiwarrior]

Anyone have an answer to the Montero alternator?

[pennyman1]

depends on the year Montero and the motor it is off of. If the mount is the same, you will just have to switch pulleys to match the v belts on your truck, and maybe change the plug on the harness, although your truck should match the new alternator. A starquest (Starion / Conquest) alternator is another choice -75 to 100 amp depending on year and model. There is also a Mitsubishi van alternator that is a direct bolt in - 75 amp minimum.

[Yoshiwarrior]

Yeah the shaft is a different size. Now I'm having trouble finding a different pulley.