Coolant doing weird things

[Jmuirhead9]

Hey people of the Mighty Ram,

So I'm getting coolant bubbling out of my overflow tank.

I'm not over heating, until a long drive the other day when I did due to coolant loss.

But usually is running normal temp, when I stop can hear the tank bubbling over. Just keep having to top up rad once in a while.

Weird thing yesterday, temp gauge was spiked, but had no heat blowing...Radiator didn't feel very warm. Lower rad hose was cool.

A few people told me head gasket...Want to be sure before I assume that and decide if I'm going to take it on.

Thanks alot!

[skullzaflare]

The beginning sounds like a cracked head to me, pushing compression into coolant chamber and slowly pushing it out the tank. However last sounds like a large air pocket which would be more likely to a headgasket

[camoit]

Yup. Head needs to come off. Cracked warped bad gasket. No matter what it needs to come off. Also it will drink a tank of water over night is another sign. But bubbles = compression into cooling system. It will take a week for it to take a big crap. Then your screwed

[Jmuirhead9]

Shit alright, thanks guys.

It's been doing it on and off for a while now, so definitely over a week, ...Although it seems more frequent now.

My roommate is trying to convince me to just put in one of those gasket sealers, apparently his guy at lordco swears by the one product that is like $60 a bottle. I'm willing to try but I do worry it'll mess things up in there. Not sure I'm able to pay someone to do the head gasket + maybe head...And it'd be a big job for a guy like me. Sure I could get er done but it's a bit daunting.

Anyways thanks for the input!

[camoit]

The way to test it is to take a coolant pressurizer test pump and put it on the radiator. Then start the truck. If the head gasket is gone it will self pressurize and the gauge will go up while you are looking at it.

[skullzaflare]

Shit alright, thanks guys.

It's been doing it on and off for a while now, so definitely over a week, ...Although it seems more frequent now.

My roommate is trying to convince me to just put in one of those gasket sealers, apparently his guy at lordco swears by the one product that is like $60 a bottle. I'm willing to try but I do worry it'll mess things up in there. Not sure I'm able to pay someone to do the head gasket + maybe head...And it'd be a big job for a guy like me. Sure I could get er done but it's a bit daunting.

Anyways thanks for the input!
please dont, it will not help, just help clog heatercore and make a mess in the block

[geezer101]

+1 on that. Those stop leak products are the things douche bags use to offload a car with problems. It's a band aid fix that doesn't last and comes back to haunt you when you finally decide to do the job properly. Hard to get out of the radiator and cooling system - you practically need to strip everything down and hot tank it to clean it out. A cylinder head isn't a great job for a novice mechanic to tackle but as long as you have a torque wrench and you set the timing belt right, it's only a matter of taking off the manifolds and undoing a handful of head bolts. Better if you had another head waiting to be bolted up.

[Jmuirhead9]

Thanks for the good honest advice dudes.

[Jmuirhead9]

Just got a New head gasket, used 4d56 head out of a Delica. Head was pressure tested and came off a running vehicle without any issues to do with the head (probably should have had it planed but that's another story).

On my drive to the new town I'm living in I stopped to check things out, saw that coolant was bubbling out the overflow again and the tank was full...ran to the point of it starting to get hot and stopped for the night. In the AM the reservoir was back to normal level, and I was able to drive again no sign of issues...still driving ok, so thoughts could be slow pressure build up on longer drives.

So where I am now they don't have the tools to do a compression test on my diesel, and he didn't want to do the coolant pressure check with the pump as reccomended here. Can I just do a poor mans test with a balloon over the rad and if it inflates there's exhaust coming through?

Mechanic said it could be my thermostat randomly closing, forcing coolant back out the reservoir. Would that happen?

You guys are my saviors because many mechanics I talk to just seem like they don't know much about these diesels.

[tortron]

Never heard of a thermostat doing that, normally it would fail in the open position

You can test this way

https://youtu.be/JAJLMd46ySU

[skullzaflare]

Did you verify no cracks in the used head? usually a new head is around the same cost as a used head shipped.
Another possibility would be a crack in the block

[Jmuirhead9]

Yes the used head was pressure tested, so shouldn't be any cracks, and the guy seems like a legit mechanic who knows these engines well...too bad I'm not near him anymore so can't talk to him easily.

[geezer101]

It keeps pointing towards a thermostat issue. Cold bottom hose, radiator is cool to touch, no heater. They don't always fail the way you expect them to - I've had them jam partially open, had the centre of one bend out of alignment, jam fully open, the works... You have nothing to lose buying a new thermostat and gasket. Easy enough to test by dropping the old one into boiling water and watch what it wants to do (or doesn't do...) Cheaper than a cracked head. Hopefully this is the easy fix you need to get back on the road.

[Jmuirhead9]

Alright thanks guys, sounds like I should do the T-stat just to rule that out. I am now getting hot air flow from heater, running temp is lower than it used to be(before new head/gasket) and seems to take longer to warm up first thing (just an observation). Also noticed lower hose was still cold after a drive yesterday.

Any chance cooling system hasn't been properly bled after head was done? I've ran it with rad cap off, as well at high rpm with cap at first stop.

Pretty weary of the situation cause I'm getting visual bubbles out the overflow tank, and a few people have told me the only thing that could do that is exhaust in your cooling....And hoping to pin it down so I can tell the mechanic if he botched the job.

This is a long thread I know so really appreciate the feedback so far.
Can't give up on this baby, I'll admit I'm attached.

[geezer101]

Whatever the fault is, it's not a deal breaker. The bubbling through the coolant could be an exhaust leak into the system (it could even be rectified by a head gasket re-torque, don't know...) but it would be frustrating to off load your pride only to see the new owner driving it a week later after an easy fix. Keep us posted :)

[Jmuirhead9]

So I managed to get a compression test:

said just under 300 psi on all cylinders. Which seemed fine...although my manual does say should be no less than 324. Seems ok?

And I put a pressure tester on my radiator...within ten minutes of running it had pressurized to 30 psi, the max it could read. So something is definitely pressurizing my coolant....but left the shop still unsure of what's causing it.

Crack in the block? May re-torque head.

Thanks again

[geezer101]

One thing that has been overlooked - the water pump. What shape is it in? It would explain no coolant being pushed through the heater.

[Jmuirhead9]

Not sure about that one, how would one test the shape of the water pump?

I am getting heat now though

[skullzaflare]

see if they have a combustion leak tester similar to this
http://www.ebay.com/itm/like/332366539950?chn=ps&dispItem=1

You leave radiator cap off, and plug top with this, with the blue chemical in the container. if combustion gases blows through it, the fluid changes color (reusable liquid, after putting regular air through it it changes back)

Sounds to me like a cracked head, you wont lose compression numbers from it, it wont start opening up typically until the engine is heated up

[Jmuirhead9]

UPDATE:

Got my hands on a combustion leak tester kit...which showed no results of fluid changing color. It even had enough pressure to blow through the tester I did not have to use the hand pump or vaccum line. I tried it out of my exhaust pipe to be sure, and it turned yellow instantly.

So if this means that I have no issues with head/gasket leaking compression, what else would be forcing coolant to bubble out?
Feeling good if this means that it's only something to do with the cooling system and not engine.

Thanks again

[skullzaflare]

Do you have a watercooled turbo? turbo could be pushing boost into it.

[Jmuirhead9]

Pretty sure it is not water cooled.

Cheers

[skullzaflare]

if its oil only, the only other thing i can think as a possible cause would be if the head is cracked in the intake chamber, and allowing the turbo to push air into the coolant. But that would have to be a fairly big crack to allow that much that easy

[dancinggecko]

This is possibly a dumb response, but check that your radiator cap isn't bad or too low pressure. Mine has been having that problem, it doesn't overheat, and it runs great, but after a long drive I start overfilling the overflow bottle.

[Jmuirhead9]

This is possibly a dumb response, but check that your radiator cap isn't bad or too low pressure. Mine has been having that problem, it doesn't overheat, and it runs great, but after a long drive I start overfilling the overflow bottle.

Dont think so cause it's bubbling up when running with the cap off as well

[Jmuirhead9]

Ok, flushed whole cooling system to my best ability.

Tested Thermostat, opening fine.

Does this sound suspect to anyone? - After warming up (which seems to be taking longer than usual to reach temperature still) Top half of Rad is hot, while even after driving for fifteen minutes the lower tank of the Rad is cold to the touch, I mean cold, not even warm, as well as the lower hose. (I have heat inside cab)

Thoughts are if this is because the thermostat was stuck closed it wouldn't be taking longer to heat up, and would overheat. So does that sound like a clogged radiator, coolant isn't making it's way down through the Rad, and being forced out of the overflow/bubbling out the top.

Much thanks for this long winded thread and all the replies...Hopefully narrowing down on the issue!

[ragragtimetime]

what is the thermostat in use?....195f would be the uppermost limit...i'd try a higher thermostat....sounds like the one in use is opening too soon.

[BJH324JH]

Overheating can be caused by multiple things. First make sure your radiator cap is in good condition.

[camoit]

UPDATE:

Got my hands on a combustion leak tester kit...which showed no results of fluid changing color. It even had enough pressure to blow through the tester I did not have to use the hand pump or vaccum line. I tried it out of my exhaust pipe to be sure, and it turned yellow instantly.

So if this means that I have no issues with head/gasket leaking compression, what else would be forcing coolant to bubble out?
Feeling good if this means that it's only something to do with the cooling system and not engine.

Thanks again

So after going through the hole thread and taking this information as gold. I'm guessing there is a hot spot on the head or block. Now way back when you first started this was the water black and nasty?
Also. it could be a water pump and radiator problem. If it's not getting enough flow through the radiator it will allow water to boil on the rear cylinders. I have seen engines that shed a lot of rust and it collects around the rear cylinder causing a low flow. When driving these things will pump 30 gallons a minute. Water is flying through an engine. A train will pump 500 GPM. So have the radiator rodded out and swap out the pump while your doing it.
Also how hot is the heater? stick a thermometer down there and see how hot it is. If you can test it on the water lines them self. One of them point and shoot temp tools are great for finding hot spots.
Keep us up to date.

[skullzaflare]

Ok, flushed whole cooling system to my best ability.

Tested Thermostat, opening fine.

Does this sound suspect to anyone? - After warming up (which seems to be taking longer than usual to reach temperature still) Top half of Rad is hot, while even after driving for fifteen minutes the lower tank of the Rad is cold to the touch, I mean cold, not even warm, as well as the lower hose. (I have heat inside cab)

Thoughts are if this is because the thermostat was stuck closed it wouldn't be taking longer to heat up, and would overheat. So does that sound like a clogged radiator, coolant isn't making it's way down through the Rad, and being forced out of the overflow/bubbling out the top.

Much thanks for this long winded thread and all the replies...Hopefully narrowing down on the issue!
Did you put the thermostat in the right way? The spring part will face into the waterpump (as dumb as it sounds)

[Jmuirhead9]

It's a 180F Thermostat, and yeah I installed it with the spring part in the waterpump. (worth an ask)

Camoit - I don't recall the water ever looking too bad, definitely not black. I'll see if I can find one of them temp tools.

And figured I'd upload a video to give you a visual on what's happening...This is after warming up for about 1 minute. When I press the throttle the water is forced up. At this temp should it not just be circulating through the block?

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=6EtL7wdmRqc&feature=youtu.be

Thanks!!

[skullzaflare]

It's a 180F Thermostat, and yeah I installed it with the spring part in the waterpump. (worth an ask)

Camoit - I don't recall the water ever looking too bad, definitely not black. I'll see if I can find one of them temp tools.

And figured I'd upload a video to give you a visual on what's happening...This is after warming up for about 1 minute. When I press the throttle the water is forced up. At this temp should it not just be circulating through the block?

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=6EtL7wdmRqc&feature=youtu.be

Thanks!!
The thermostat wont just stay open once it hits 180, it will cycle. You have hot water at the radiator cap so it should be working.

Did you replace the waterpump? if so did you silicon it as well with the gasket? i ask because when you look up the water pump, some show it with the steel backplate (so you cant see the impeller) others without it. Mine i took off had the plate, as well as the one i put on

[Jmuirhead9]

No I have not replaced the water pump, but seems like that is the next thing. Rad or water pump first?

Cheers

[skullzaflare]

I would replace the pump first. You could "test" the pump. Take one of the heatercore hoses off and start it, it should spray lol. If it doesnt spray your pump is shot

[Jmuirhead9]

Most recent diagnosis is that my radiator is clogged.

lordco sent me the wrong one, and they don't have the proper one...rock auto seems to be the same. A radiator shop said they would re core it for $450 $&@!, which I'm not ready to fork out. Any advice on how to come by a rad that would work for the 86 ranger?
Thanks

[BradMph]

You can get any radiator at a wrecking yard in install it in our trucks. I use an oversized chevy radiator with the side tank caps instead of the top and bottom capping.
As long as the hose entrance and exit are the same place and mounting holes can have adapters made to mount the new radiator. When you get a radiator for our trucks, you better be very careful since our trucks love to crack heads from over heating. It don't take long to crack these heads and care needs to be taken and engine heat watched closely. When choosing a radiator for our trucks, NEVER get one with less vent tubing then the ones we have stock. A good upgrade would have additional tubes to reassure you get proper cooling. Also , replace the thermostat with a good name brand, preferably the OEM if you can get one.

Oh ya one more thing:
Tell them $450 radiator core people to shove it up their ass. That is the most ridiculous price I ever heard and I would never go back there again.

[geezer101]

I know a guy who is having his Mach I Rust-tank rebuilt and he is forking out $850 AU to have the original radiator re-cored. :eek:

[tortron]

$1000 for my thermosyphon minor Rae. You don't want to know how much for a beehive hexagon style one for my old commer.

Was there any reason they couldn't rod the old tank? Otherwise hit the junk yard with a measuring tape. As long as the outlets are on the right sides and it's roughly the right size you can make them fit for minimal fuss

[geezer101]

$1000 for my thermosyphon minor Rae. You don't want to know how much for a beehive hexagon style one for my old commer.

Was there any reason they couldn't rod the old tank? Otherwise hit the junk yard with a measuring tape. As long as the outlets are on the right sides and it's roughly the right size you can make them fit for minimal fuss

As part of his historic registration, he has to keep the car as close to OEM as possible. He's heard enough about ebay radiators and how not so good they are. Hey, it's his money (and his car). Still better than his brother (he paid $400 for his Mazda 808 heater re-core...)

[gustycrosswinds]

Dont think so cause it's bubbling up when running with the cap off as well


i am having this same issue where coolant is pushed to the reservoir when i shut the engine off, OP. I am going through the motions to test the coolant and engine compression. the fluid in the coolant test did not change colors, thankfully...though i know there is a possibility of a hidden crack in head or block that didn't show in the test. i replaced my rad cap and it seems to be holding pressure better than before. having my injectors rebuilt because i was blowing smoke as well, probably from bad fuel. i am ordering a new thermostat, not sure what temp to get. hoping the smoke clears after i get my injectors back from the shop. if not, i think i will have the IP rebuilt, or revisit if a new head gasket is in order.. the engine had an overhaul a few owners ago, which was potentially only a few thousand miles but this is unknown.

[tortron]

when you shut the engine off the coolant stops getting cooled, and heats up from the remaining heat in the block. So pretty normal for it to puke a little out.

[geezer101]

^if the coolant return is working properly, the coolant that has been purged into the overflow tank will be siphoned back into the radiator. As tortron has pointed out, the radiator no longer has air flow or coolant passing through it and the coolant in the block will begin to heat soak. If it passes a coolant test I would say the chances of a crack in the head, block or a failed gasket are very slim.

*don't ever check your coolant while the engine is hot. If you are desperate and need to drop engine temps quickly, pour water over the radiator slowly. This will intracool the system at a rate that won't crack the head or block and bring engine temps to below normal operating temperatures.