Mid 4G63 Swap - No Clutch Arm Tension?

[AaronB31]

So I pulled the 2.6 and wideblock transmission out of my truck to do a 4G63 swap. Naturally, I acquired a KM-132 Narrow block transmission off a 2.0 truck at a local salvage yard. Using the starion clutch kit, I bolted everything back together and it all fit great. However, there seems to be hardly any pressure on the clutch arm. I'm able to easy pull it by hand. What would cause it to be so light? Surely a bad throwout bearing wouldn't cause this, would it? Or the fact that there's no transmission fluid?

I'm using the parts that everyone who's done this swap reccomends, so I have a hard time thinking that the distance between the shaft/clutch/throwout is incorrect. Any help would be greatly appreciated.

[AaronB31]

^ By "back together" I mean that I bolted the KM132 to the 4G63 (from a 1999 eclipse if that makes any difference).

[geezer101]

You can eliminate the 'bad throw-out' bearing theory and no gearbox oil as the issue. The second the throw out bearing makes contact with the pressure plate the clutch arm will load up from tension. Being able to actuate it by hand directly by the clutch arm would take some serious effort so for some reason there's a clearance issue between the throw out bearing carrier/clutch arm and the pressure plate. Only way to test the theory is getting the rear up on axle stands, starting the truck and actuating the clutch pedal.

[AaronB31]

Unfortunately the engine is a ways from starting. Piping, plumbing, and wiring still need to be made. I can tell by the feel of the clutch arm that there's no engagement at all, which surprises me since everyone else seems to use this setup without issue.

ive got the DSM flywheel, starion clutch (LUK 05-041, I went cheap just in case something like this happened), DSM pressure plate, and 2.0 mighty max throwout bearing.

[AaronB31]

An update for anyone who might be interested. The excessive play in the clutch arm is due to the throwout bearing being way too far away from the pressure plate. Im going to see if I can shim it closer to the plate, find a bigger one off a different mitsubishi. Please let me know if you guys know of anything. I highly doubt they make adjustable throwout bearings for mitsubishis/

[geezer101]

Need to compare the DSM pressure plate vs MM and the throw out bearing carrier. Might be a difference in carrier sizes (DSM/KM132/KM145). I looked at the FWD clutch arm and it looks like it has very short travel. Does it feel like it even makes contact with the pressure plate when you actuate it?

[4doorciv]

I used the dsm tob from the dealership. The cable adjustment was practically at the max adjustment to be able to release the tob. Firewall flex and pressure took wear on the bracket that the cable attaches to the bell housing. I had to use a shim recently after 8 years of use.

[4doorciv]

The dsm and mm tob is the same at the dealership. The difference is the aftermarket replacements.

[DroppedMitsu]

I used the exact same setup as you. Like said, I had to max out my clutch cable adjustment I believe to get the throw out bearing to be able to engage the clutch.

[geezer101]

So theoretically, you could make a spacer shim that goes in between the throw out bearing and bearing carrier seat, say 1/4", and that would take up the travel on the bearing carrier.

[AaronB31]

Need to compare the DSM pressure plate vs MM and the throw out bearing carrier. Might be a difference in carrier sizes (DSM/KM132/KM145). I looked at the FWD clutch arm and it looks like it has very short travel. Does it feel like it even makes contact with the pressure plate when you actuate it?

It barely touches the pressure plate at the very end of the clutch arm travel. Correct me if I'm wrong, but that issue has nothing to do with the clutch cable. It's just the TOB being way too far away from the pressure plate.

[AaronB31]

So theoretically, you could make a spacer shim that goes in between the throw out bearing and bearing carrier seat, say 1/4", and that would take up the travel on the bearing carrier.

That's exactly what I'm working on. Going to take measurements from the FWD transmission and shim the TOB on the new transmission to get it where it needs to be. I wonder why no one else has had this problem when using the same setup? Oh well.

I'll keep you guys updated. Thanks for all the input!

[geezer101]

... I wonder why no one else has had this problem when using the same setup?

Thing is, they do have the same issue but just accept it's part of the deal. Firewall flex does not help either. Going hydraulic solves one problem and creates a bunch of new ones. Good luck with designing a carrier shim, keep us posted :thumbup:

[AaronB31]

Thing is, they do have the same issue but just accept it's part of the deal. Firewall flex does not help either. Going hydraulic solves one problem and creates a bunch of new ones. Good luck with designing a carrier shim, keep us posted :thumbup:

You know I thought as much, except for this nicely detailed post by DroppedMitsu that explains a lot of minor things but nothing about any TOB issue: http://www.mightyram50.net/vbulletin/showthread.php/1700-Eclipse-DSM-Dohc-4G63-4G63T-swap-information

I just wondered if anyone knew something I didnt. Anyhow, that's just how working on cars goes, am I right? I'll get it done and plan on making a detailed account of every step so as to help anyone else who dares to do this swap!

[geezer101]

I just wondered if anyone knew something I didnt. Anyhow, that's just how working on cars goes, am I right? I'll get it done and plan on making a detailed account of every step so as to help anyone else who dares to do this swap!

Someone always a tip or a trick to fix an unforeseen glitch, the hard part is either finding the info yourself or figuring out how the hell they managed to pull it off themselves. I'd love to build an NA tuned 4G63 twin cam for my truck at some stage but the majority of data is for a turbo/injected build. Extra cam would be nice but I'm an old fool for old school :grin:

[4doorciv]

I shimmed the clutch cable where the cable meets the bracket. Gives more adjustment for later. I have not had the need to adjust the clutch cable once it was adjusted till the cable broke.

[AaronB31]

18992
For anyone interested, this is my solution to the problem. I still had the transmission from my donor car laying around, so I took a bunch of measurements and compared them to measurements on the KM132 to find that the TOB was indeed 1/4" too far away from the pressure plate. All I did was press the center shaft out of the bearing, then slowly insert it back until the assembly was 1/4" taller. After a little welding she fits perfectly and gives the measurements I needed :)

[AaronB31]

Update: Truck started up and drove today. This modification worked great. Anyone having this problem, take careful measurements and this works with no issues.

[geezer101]

Ugly welds, awesome fix. Good work - this should leave you with plenty of room for adjustment. :thumbup:

*bet there's a throw out bearing carrier somewhere out there that is compatible for this transmission set up...

[Lon Moer]

I shimmed the clutch cable where the cable meets the bracket. Gives more adjustment for later. I have not had the need to adjust the clutch cable once it was adjusted till the cable broke.

I did this too, until I ordered the shorter ch cable.